Naturist Podcast Ep. 6 // What it’s Like to Live in 250 sq. ft.in an Intentional Nude Community

There's so many people that have been disappointed with the experience that they've had in places where they're trying to be nude. We want people to be able to enjoy this way of living and I think it gets really skewed by these places that don't have their shit together. So let's get our shit together, guys. That's why we're talking about the intentional nudist community and what works and what doesn't.
Mandy Zelinka
Skinny Dippers Club

Naturist Podcast Ep. 6 // What it’s Like to Live in 250 sq. ft.in an Intentional Nude Community

SHOW NOTES

Speaker 1:

You guys. I think we relaxed too hard. We are on like the fifth try of doing our podcast. We maxed and relaxed way too hard. What were we doing all day yesterday? What were we watching?

Speaker 2:

We got hooked on a new series. It’s not new, but it’s new to us. I was introduced to it by a friend at work – it’s called Letterkenny. It’s on Hulu and I highly recommend it. But warning, you’re going to get sucked in.

Speaker 1:

Well, you might. It’s one of those, like either you totally get it or you don’t because for the first two seasons, I was like, what the fuck is this? And then season three, four, and five. I was like, Oh, this is good.

Speaker 2:

It reminds me of a little bit of Napoleon dynamite mixed with a couple of other shows that I can’t think of it off the top of my head. But

Speaker 1:

So it takes place in a small town in Canada, which has just been a delight to watch because you know, the last four years living in the States has just been a lot. And so to just watch these, these people in Canada, just hanging out and being Canadian, it’s just been pure joy.

Speaker 2:

It’s been really good. Yeah. And it’s really nice to see. There’s a bunch of little micro communities within this tiny community. Like you’ve got the emo kids who do their weird dancing and stuff and you’ve got the jock kids. Yeah. You’ve got the parking lot druggies farm boys and the kinda the, the rural setting kids. 

Speaker 1:

It absolutely reminds me of high school because where I went, it was a public school and I always call it the, the “fame” of tech schools for any of you that remember that show. If I remember correctly, it was like a high school for like the elite dancers. But it was a public high school you had to apply to get in that you had to have like above a 3.0 average and you couldn’t be a discipline problem. 

Speaker 2:

So I would not have qualified. 

Speaker 1:

Why wouldn’t you qualified?

Speaker 2:

I was just having fun. 

Speaker 1:

I was like, I’m pretty sure you weren’t a discipline problem. Pretty sure  you got decent grades. So what it did was it, it offered the opportunity to have this super diverse high school experience, not only with different diverse ethnicities, but yes, you had like the emo kids in the parking lot getting high, the art kids. And then you had the tech kids. Then you had the nerds and you had the sluts and the other jocks and they, they all, we all got along. And that’s what I think I’ve been loving most about this show is as the characters evolve, they’re in this small community of what was it? 5,000 residents. Yeah. And they’re all tasked with trying to figure out how to get along,

Speaker 2:

When I was mayor of the small town down in, in Portland that had 22,000 residents, so it would be,

Speaker 1:

Oh my God. And you also had to deal with bird shit.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. So we watched an episode about Canada goose on the golf course. Yeah. And I had to deal with Canada goose shitr at our riverfront

Speaker 1:

Park. Yeah. That was a lot.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. So every episode it’s like, Oh, okay.

Speaker 1:

We get that way when we watch Parks and Rec too. Yeah. So yeah, it’s been fun to watch, but that really brings us to tiny intentional living. Not because they have tiny living houses on there, but you know, they’re all in a community. The intentional part of it is that they’re there in a small town and they are not going anywhere.

Speaker 2:

They’re staying intentionally. So it’s an intentional community.

Speaker 1:

Many folks in our community are working on creating nude spaces for rent, whether it’s a yurt in their backyard or like five to 20 acres of space that they want to build on to rent out. My first house was 600 square feet. It was my, it was one of my favorite houses because I loved how small it was. And it, it takes like 15 minutes to clean the house. Okay. But I’ll be honest. I also really did love my mid century modern home because I do love architecture and pretty things. But when we decided to move up here, we were just like, let’s just immerse ourselves in this and, and get to know all of it because you know, the best way to do that is just to, dive in if you can. And so we’re on about 40 acres. There’s about 30 to 40 other people here. There’s people in RVs. Like, does everybody understand what that means?

Speaker 2:

Oh, well, if you’re in England, it would be like a caravan. So it’s a, there are people that live in motorized, recreational vehicles and tow behind recreational vehicles. I think that’s probably the easiest way to,

Speaker 1:

And on the edge of the property – there are tiny homes. And if you come rent here, you get a little bird house, which is,

Speaker 2:

It’s basically a glorified garden shed with power and a bed and a refrigerator in it. It’s well insulated…

Speaker 1:

We’ve stayed in there plenty of times before we moved up here. Yeah. Actually I kinda like it, but I think one of the most interesting things that I have found living here is as a city girl, it’s the infrastructure that you need to maintain a piece of property of this size. And I think I’ve talked before about how my family also has 40 acres of property. And they are fortunate enough to have a spring on it. So they have fresh spring water, just like we have here. But you know, not only do you need the infrastructure, if your 40 acres is not within, like, how would you explain that? Like, we’re not, we’re in the middle of a thriving big county, but yet we’re all alone in the middle of a hill. How do explain that from an infrastructure perspective?

Speaker 2:

So we’re close to city amenities and, you know, we have access to things like garbage service and providers that will deliver propane and that sort of thing. But we’re far enough out that we don’t have a connection to municipal water municipal sewer. So depending on where you’re located, you have to be prepared for that.

Speaker 1:

Yeah. Which now that we’re talking about septic systems, I read an article last week that had me cracking up. So a ton of people that own second homes in the Hamptons have decided to stay there through the winter because of COVID. So the Hamptons is on the East side of New York on the east coast. And the Hamptons can’t handle it because they aren’t used to people staying over the winter and these peoples septic systems are all backing up because they also don’t know how to deal with their septic system over the winter. And there’s not enough service providers to maintain these homes over the winter. It’s fascinating. Cause they used to

Speaker 2:

Be occasional use vacation homes and now they’re being used full time. So they’re not used to the septic systems filling up so quickly. Yes.

Speaker 1:

So the Hamptons, they don’t have restaurants open. They don’t have their, you know, fresh farmer’s market food every week that they’re used to.

So yeah. Can you talk, you are you’re the infrastructure guy. So Jeremy is basically like the public works director for the county -sh. And when he was mayor, I mean, you basically have the same job when you were the mayor. Right?

Speaker 2:

Well, similar, I mean, I was more on the policy side than, than the operations side, but

Speaker 1:

Yes. How would you describe what goes for viewers at home that are considering doing this? This is part of why we wanted to do this podcast because not many people get the opportunity to live this way and experience it. So what goes into not only like building and setting up a property like this, but I know we’ve talked a lot before about how volunteer driven communities typically aren’t enough. We have seen where nudist parks are largely volunteer driven and have worked. But I don’t think that that’s a sustainable business model. Yeah. So explain to me, Hey Jeremy, I’m looking at buying 20 to 40 acres of property. What all do I need to get that going for people to come and stay with

Speaker 2:

So there’s a lot of folks out there that we interact with that are in different parts of different stages of trying to get their own property set up. And some people have the professional background of being in hospitality. Other people have a professional background in, you know, a variety of other places. Mine is in infrastructure. So that’s kind of what I want to talk about it a little bit.

Speaker 1:

Billions of dollar infrastructure.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. So I oversee about 1500 miles of roads and 182 bridges and all the guard rail and infrastructure stuff that goes along with that. So when you’re looking at properties, some of the first things that we’ve been taking a look at as we’ve been looking through laws and stuff, I would actually put it ahead of looking at water is seeing whether you’re adjacent to public lands or not. We’ve been looking at that. Yeah. So for example, the place where we live right now, it’s 40 acres, but it’s adjacent to state property. It adds huge value because we are adjacent to thousands and thousands of acres of property where it’s legal to hike on those trails nude.

Speaker 1:

I think one of the most interesting things when we started living here is that I love doing market research. So in the research that I found with this particular property, it was that people love to hike. They love to come up and hike, but I swear the entire board thinks that their profit model is all based on the pool, which it is – the pool is a huge selling point, but I don’t think they even realize how much of the value of this property is access to the hiking.

Speaker 2:

So you can actually draw people into your property to pay for parking at the very least. Oh yeah. To park here, strip down and head up into the state lands and hike naked. 

Speaker 1:

I think that’s also another thing that we’ve learned living here is that there are opportunities all over the place that get missed If you don’t run your property with a business mind or do market research.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. Yeah. So after you pick your location 

Speaker 1:

And you have to think about permitting because we were like, sorry, you were about to say that I’ll shut up

Speaker 2:

During the process of looking for your place you need to look at what’s permissible in your area, whether you can run a camp or a Air BnB or whatever it is. So, but I think some of the important things is looking to see if you’re adjacent to other public lands and then what’s your access for power, water and sewer, those big, those three things. And then I would say actually ranking up there really high is access to internet because we have found some great properties that we’ve looked at to potentially buy, but there’s no way in heck that we’re going to be able to get any type of internet out there. And in today’s age, you need internet. So, so power water, some way to handle your wastewater and internet are the four big things.

Speaker 1:

Something I brought up to you the other day that I’m not sure that you realize you have to find is real estate agents don’t sell land, land brokers, sell land. I’m not sure if I’m using the right words, verbiage for that. But like, yes, you could buy land from someone who’s selling residential real estate, but you really should buy land from someone that sells land. And part of it is because of the permitting and all of those things.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. And actually taking the time to work with somebody that can do the research for you. Cause a lot of times like I know code pretty well, but I don’t know California code very well at all. So I’ve tried to stumble my way through looking at San Bernardino County code to see if I can do what we want to do with property down there. But if you’re not familiar with it, it can be kind of hard. So connecting with somebody that’s familiar with the codes in your area’s going to be super helpful.

Speaker 1:

They was something else we were looking at for a while at the beginning of the pandemic, a lot of people in our community were totally stoked on starting a victory garden. We got really excited about us all like being able to live off the land and eat from it that ended up going sideways for other reasons. But I still love the idea of it. And you were looking at, was it Patagonia down in Arizona for homesteading? They had, there was a tax thing on that. Was there not?

Speaker 2:

No, it was actually the way, the way in which your, your property is protected. They, you, up to a certain dollar amount was protected from bankruptcy. Cause a lot, a lot of the actual concerns during the beginning, part of the pandemic was people talking about going bankrupt and what would happen with their property. And yeah, it could still happen, but it was interesting to look at the bankruptcy laws and how your property is zoned and what the laws in your state are about what would be turned over in a bankruptcy. So,

Speaker 1:

No, I appreciate that information. But what I was specifically talking about is there was something where you could buy five acres of land and if it was considered homesteading, it was tax exempt up to some point or something, wasn’t it?

Speaker 2:

Yeah. It was – I can’t remember what the – I want to say it was Patagonia, but there was a program for tax exemption, but that’s going to vary by County and state.

Speaker 1:

Yeah. But it’s interesting to know that those things exist for people that, you know, want to get into this and don’t have a million dollars. I mean, we’re sitting on a $2.2 million property here, which is why every time I complain about tiny, intentional living, I look at the view out front and I’m like, Oh, shut up, Mandy. You get a sunset view that you pay nothing for

Speaker 2:

Yeah. To be honest. Yeah. It’s pretty nice.

Speaker 1:

So Jeremy, what’s it like living in 250 square feet?

Speaker 2:

Well, you’re really got to be,

Speaker 1:

You gotta like the person, you’re living with. Gotta be good friends with the person you live with. Yeah. That’s true. You gotta be friends, man. Yeah.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. In fact, as you’re watching this right now, it looks like we’re sitting really close it’s because we’re sitting really close. Yeah.

Speaker 1:

Behind us is the kitchen.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. So we put this, this is just a, like a photographer’s backdrop that we put up. So that way you don’t have to see our kitchen stove behind you.

Speaker 1:

Yeah. It’s, it’s tiny. It’s small. You, you hear everything. Yeah.

Speaker 2:

So the way that this property is set up is all of the living areas is kind of smushed together probably about a five acre corner of the property, I would say. Yeah. So we’re all smushed together in a, in a cluster, we’ll just call it a cluster. And 

Speaker 1:

You’re talking about, we live in a cluster on the 40 acres is what you’re getting. Yeah.

Speaker 2:

We live in a cluster with the other 30, some odd people in a corner of the 40 acre woods,

Speaker 1:

Which I recommend. It’s like a neighborhood and, and like any neighborhood, your neighbors on the other street, may be ones you don’t want to hang out with. And that’s a normal neighborhood. Like, you know, we would get together over the summer and people would be gossiping. And I’m like, wait, wait, wait, I don’t want to know that about my neighbor. It’s none of my business.

Speaker 2:

But if you’re going to get into this for yourself and you’re going to have your own intentional community it’s important that you figure out a way to go into this with other, people that are going to be supportive of your community.

Speaker 1:

Yes. Which I’d like to get into in a moment. And I’d like to get into that by starting with a story about, I wasn’t going to share this story, but I think it’s, I think it’s really important. In our last episode, we talked about our nude road trip. I started mentioning how it actually went very poorly at the beginning. And so we course corrected and ended up at Tuscany Manor, which ended up being great. Everything happens for a reason, but so we visited another tiny, intentional living community down in So-Cal at Olive Dell Ranch. And this is what happens when I don’t even know how to explain it. I’m just gonna tell you, Oh, go ahead. Can I try to explain it? He’s much better at that than I am.

Speaker 2:

So I it’s hard because I, I want to support other, other nudist properties, but we also had a bad experience. And I think I want to chalk it up to a couple of different things. One is us not understanding what to expect when we went in and, and their change in demographics within these places that are trying to stay in business and not really setting expectations. So we had a bad experience. And I think that community is right for the people who live there,

Speaker 1:

Break it down. Like when you have an intentional living community and everyone is not on board with either being a nudist or being nice to new people then you’re really doing a dissservice to your intentional living community. A lot of these places either have a board where like too many people are in charge of making decisions. So they don’t make a decision or they recognize that they have been around so long that they’re having a hard time righting the ship. And so with this particular experience, what happened was we came in and this older woman shamed me. And yes, she was living there because she is a nudist, but she wasn’t on board with the intentions of what the community was trying to do, which is be an open and inclusive community for all ages, genders, whatever types of nudists. And she was stuck on this particular way that you should be a nudist, which a lot of older nudists tend to be 

Speaker 2:

Which is not how we perceived the park to be. That’s where I was trying to get at with the communication, people that were living there that didn’t meet the standards that were communicated by the park.

Speaker 1:

How were they communicated? Cause I didn’t make those reservations.

Speaker 2:

Well I’ve I followed what was on there on their website. And it seemed as if it was going to be a safe and inclusive community,

Speaker 1:

Which is why I think it’s very fair to not be out there redoing websites for people that shouldn’t have their websites redone.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. Actually as you and I have both done work for other individuals and we have, you know, I’ve, I’ve helped people manage political campaigns and I’ve worked with nonprofits and you’ve, you’ve worked with a variety of people through doing freelance work. And I think

Speaker 1:

You can’t sell somebody one thing and have them walk in the door and get another.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. In this community, particularly in the naturist community, you have to be sure that the people that you work with are people that are aligned with your brand and standards and, and with your level of comfortability going into that particular

Speaker 1:

Well, and that really feeds into my… I have always wanted to franchise – always. I really wanted to franchise my salon because I knew how strong the culture was that I had built. It’s still there. That salon has been there for like 30 years. I took it over at some point – it had been a different salon, but I mean, I think that’s a real testament to my work – I’m not gonna lie. You know, these other people have carried on the culture of what we turned it around to be, and it’s been fantastic. And there’s so many people that have been disappointed with the experience that they’ve had in places where they’re trying to be nude, that it would just be so great to franchise a brand and a community and all the things that you can actually look on the website and see what it is and walk in and actually get that, which is part of, part of our mission. You know, we want people to be able to enjoy this way of living and in order to do that

Speaker 2:

Well, it’s more than a way of, I think it’s more than just a way of living. It’s a way of acceptance

Speaker 1:

And recreation and mental health and just all the great things that go into it. I think it’s really skewed by these places that don’t have their shit together. So let’s get our shit together, guys. That’s why we’re talking about the intentional nudist community and what works and what doesn’t. And one of the other things that we have found that doesn’t work is when this seems obvious, but if you live in an intentional nudist community, you should be a nudist.

Speaker 2:

As we have lived in this community, I think we’ve evolved from kind of, I mean, I’m, I’m not so much a clothing optional. I, I, I’m more of a naturist Mandy still clothing optional.

Speaker 1:

Yeah. Okay. So we move into this community, right? We assume everyone is a nudist because why would you live in a nudist community if you aren’t a nudist? Well, come to find out, some people get into a nudist community because let’s be honest, it’s cheap to live here. It’s very cost-effective.

Speaker 2:

And they got in because they have friends or family that live here and they got the votes to get them approved, to live in the community. And they weren’t.

Speaker 1:

There’s that. And then another problem, which you should know, if you want to open your own nudist, intentional living community, or I know not all places do this – run background checks. Most places will run a background check on you. Well, they aren’t always extensive enough. And if you’re going to have a community where people are living there in a nudist community, I would assume you would want them to be safe, but you can’t always assume they run background checks, but they aren’t always extensive enough. And I’m going to let Jeremy explain how some people might get through the cracks that shouldn’t be there because the background check didn’t show anything bad.

Speaker 2:

So there’s different levels of background checks. I know at a lot of the places that I’ve been here in Washington, they typically for a nudist place, they run a sexual offender registry background check in the state of Washington. So if you’re visiting from the state of Idaho, just hypothetically 

Speaker 1:

It happens a lot. People will drive all the way across the U S to come here.

Speaker 2:

I just discovered that we’re only six hours from Montana and we drive six and a half hours down to Eugene to go to the Willamettans, which is our favorite nudist park in the world, in the Northwest.  So somebody could drive from Montana, come to this nudist park and get in and do a background check and come back clear because they’re a Montana resident, but they may have a list of felonies or sexual offenses, a mile long. A Montana person would not come up under the sexual registry offender list in Washington. So I think it’s important to do a, some kind of a background check that is at the very least in a nationwide background check.

Speaker 1:

You don’t want felons living in your nudists park.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. And there’s a difference between doing like a one day pass. I mean, if somebody acts inappropriately, you can usually get on top of it and boot them out pretty quick. But if you are doing a background screening to have somebody live here in your community, do a full background check. It was like, when we investigated how much it was going to cost, it was like 59 bucks. So include that in the application fee to have somebody live in your community and just add that as an extra 59 bucks, if they really want to live there, they’ll pay the extra money to do the nationwide background check.

Speaker 1:

And the other thing we found out is, you know, some people would have family members visit or move in with them that weren’t nudists –  that it doesn’t work, friends. So I’m going to say it out that for now

Speaker 2:

I’ll speak in really general terms.

Speaker 1:

We had a neighbor

Speaker 2:

Who had a family member move in with them. They were not a nudist and not only were they not a nudist, they gave their other family members a hard time about being nudists as well as the other neighbors, including me and Mandy. So you go from this great place that you’ve moved into where you’re expecting everybody

Speaker 1:

Naked. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 2:

And then somebody moves in and they’re going to give you a hard time about running around with your pants off to the point that you don’t want to step out of your own home with your pants off. That’s really freaking uncomfortable

Speaker 1:

And fascinating. I, for the longest time, I was like, well, I don’t know what the big deal is about having people that aren’t nudists live here. Well, you know not everybody wants to live in a nudist community because they have good intentions. Let’s just leave it at that. Yes. We’ve had those conversations, which is why, you know, it’s really important that it seems so obvious, but you know, again, these, aren’t the things that you’ll find out until you move into a community like this. Like I would think it would be super obvious that you would run extensive background checks before anybody lives here. I mean, we’re a mile up the road. There’s no way to get to the road. What am I trying to say? One of my neighbors, cars doesn’t work. And for him to get to the bus, he has to walk a mile down the road to get to the bus.

Speaker 1:

You know, you’re a mile up the road with these other 40 people. You know, there’s, you, can’t not do extensive background checks. If you have a community in the middle of nowhere, that we’re all dependent on each other for this place to thrive. If the water stops working, we have to go fix it. The city doesn’t come out for that. We’ve had trees fall over our road and you can’t get up and down the road. We’ve had wash outs you know, all sorts of because we’re in the middle of a mountain. I’m like, I don’t mind, depending on my neighbors, I love the idea of being in the community with like minded people. It sounds like Nirvana. But I, I don’t, I don’t want to do that with felons.

Speaker 2:

Well, and you want to make sure that the people that you’re going to you know, go cut down a tree with- it’s blocking the road -is safe people that have been screened and it’s different living in an intentional community where you’re building the community in and, I don’t want to say necessarily any co-op style because we’re not co-oping too in the, in the formal sense, but we are leaning on each other to make sure that we have all the things that we need, because we are not reliant upon municipal standard municipal services, like water, sewer roads that are maintained by the government because we maintain all of that ourselves.

Speaker 1:

And, and I’m not saying all felons are bad. I’m not, people can be rehabbed, there’s mistakes. There’s a ton of people that go to jail that shouldn’t, I get that there are certain crimes that these people should not be allowed to be in for having done. Like, if you are a felon because of some like drug charges, weed or whatever, I don’t care. The system is totally fucked up on that stuff. But

Speaker 2:

If it’s sexual unrelated in any way.

Speaker 1:

Or theft, you know, big theft. Yeah.

Speaker 2:

I mean, not shoplifting or something, but if it’s breaking and entering or something like that,

Speaker 1:

Grand theft auto,

Speaker 2:

I would say anything that’s violence related. For sure. Anyway you all get

Speaker 1:

The point. So yeah. I mean, that’s something you have to take under consideration. It has caused a lot of problems here, those two things alone. And now that those two things have been eradicated from here it’s a completely different experience. So that would be my main takeaway.

Speaker 2:

Well, you now feel comfortable to go out and exercise with your pants off the trail, in a place where you should be able to exercise with pants off.

Speaker 1:

So let’s get back to this tiny living. So I feel like we’ve, we’ve talked about infrastructure. We’ve talked about things you need to look out for. Did we miss anything though? 

Speaker 2:

I, so I think some of the things that you need to look for, if you’re going to invest into a property is make sure that your access to that property, if your intent is to live there year round, that it’s accessible year round, there are some places that you might be interested in looking at and you see it in the summertime. And you’re like, Oh man, this looks like a great place. Look to see if it snows in the winter time. And if it snows in the winter time, are you going to have the equipment to clear the snow off of your property? Will your solar panels or your electric electrical source be available? Is your water still gonna run in the winter time?

Speaker 1:

Okay. Which brings me to a really great question about infrastructure. There are some things on this property that you have said when we get our property, you need to have, and they’re like $20,000 pieces of equipment. What, what are those?

Speaker 2:

Some kind of a backhoe or tractor I think is imperative for anybody that’s going to buy a piece of property that you’re going to live on that’s more than five acres. There’s a variety of different pieces of equipment out there. And you can find them used on Craigslist or equipment companies, or you can rent them. The only downside with renting some of these smaller pieces of equipment is you’re going to probably need to rent them during an emergency. And if there’s an emergency, everybody else wants them too. So if you have, at the very least, like on this property, we have a skid steer. It’s like a Bobcat with tracks and a bucket. And that helps considerably. 

Speaker 1:

Okay. But not only do you need to have this equipment, you have to know how to run it because

Speaker 2:

You gotta know how to use it.

Speaker 1:

Yeah. I think Jeremy is the only person here that actually knows how to use it. Jeremy, if he had not been here two weeks ago, our neighbor’s RV would not be where it’s supposed to be.

Speaker 2:

That’s true. They got an RV delivered. Cause they bought a bigger RV to live in. And they couldn’t, they got stuck trying to get into the space that they were getting into. So I went up and grabbed the piece of equipment and literally used a chain and drag their trailer into the right spot.

Speaker 1:

That’s what happens when you drop that zero and start getting with the hero. I love that I live with MacGyver now. Okay. So that’s another thing you need on your list. You need infrastructure, you need to do background checks and you need a MacGyver, which is true. Like you have to have someone in charge of maintenance for a facility of this size.

Speaker 2:

Yes. And you need to know just a little bit about many different things.  It doesn’t mean that you have to be an expert because I am not an expert. I’m not an expert at running that little piece of equipment. I’m not, I’m not an expert when it comes to water systems or electrical systems, but I know enough…

Not only do I know just enough, but I also know that I can go to the Google and or to the interwebs and look up stuff.

Speaker 1:

So when you look at property, because this dude has been looking at property for a long time, what are you specifically looking for? So, first of all, I need to explain that we live in the Pacific Northwest, which is on the upper left coast of the United States. So it rains a lot. It snows a little bit. So I understand that our difficulties on this land are going to be different than where we’re looking, which is someplace that’s really sunny and dry and desert because let’s be honest. Most nudists want to go to a place that’s sunny. So it’s going to be in the Southern part of the U S typically or you know, a place that there’s more sun. So one, what do you look for and two? What are the different things with climate change that you look for considering it’s a property where it’s mostly sunny versus up here in the Pacific Northwest where it rains a lot.

Speaker 2:

Okay. So actually, let’s talk about what we’re looking for specifically for us. That probably works. So we’re looking in Southern California and I think the big thing for me is what does the property look like 12 months out of the year? Do I have access to it all year round or during those seasonal rainy times? Does it get washed out? There’s actually a thing called washes when you’re looking at desert property and you want to make sure that your wash, which is where the flash floods go, that it doesn’t wash out. Cause people die that way. Turn around. Don’t drown.

Speaker 1:

What!

Speaker 2:

It’s a phrase. Turn around. Don’t drown. If you, if you drive into certain areas, actually you’ll see, like when we go up into Joshua tree on some of the roads, it’ll say “warning flash flood area. 

Speaker 1:

One of the most disturbing things I’ve ever been through is watching my husband on the little speaker thing, go Mayday, Mayday. I was like, what the fuck? I’ve only seen that in movies. This is happening in real time. And then the Seattle, the Seattle water cops pull up in their water cop boat thing and bail us out. And Jeremy’s so nervous. He’s offering them croissants. Anyway. I was like, this is the epitome of white privilege. I am between the Seattle Yacht Club and UDuB, and we’re sinking. And the Seattle police come by and bail us out. They didn’t take the croissants, but

Speaker 2:

So we may have learned a thing or two about being prepared before you dive into a new adventure.

Speaker 1:

Yes. We always say it’s, “are we going to sink it this time? Like, is this a good idea? Or a bad idea?” Yeah.

Speaker 2:

So looking at your property, you want to make sure that it’s accessible year round. If you intend to use it year round, if you intend to only use it during particular seasons, fine, but you still gotta make sure that you’re not going to get a section of your property destroyed that you want to use too, because we’re looking down on the desert water and water storage is the big thing that we’re looking at. So the place is either going to have a natural spring or an area to store water or the ability to dig a well, that’s not too terribly deep. That it’s cost prohibitive.

Speaker 2:

No, you have to, and it’s not just the water source, but the water storage, because if you lose power then you’re not going to pump water. So you know, that’s why I say it’s a spring or a, well at your parents’ property, you, we, we could have set that up so that the water would gravity feed into the water storage, but a place like the desert, you’re going to need to pump that water, you need electricity. So do you have power from the local electric company or do you have solar power? And do you have a battery backup in case something fails? 

Speaker 1:

Okay. So he works on a 40 acre campus and the electricity failed and then the generator failed and you guys didn’t have power for like three days or something crazy. Right?

Speaker 2:

Well, the generator failed to kick on when the power went out, we got the generator going, but it’s just one of those things that you have to realize that sometimes even your emergency generator needs an emergency backup just in case. That’s why I go outside and make sure that our generator works about once a month. I kick it on and run it for about an hour just in case.

Speaker 1:

Okay. I have a cost question. How much was our generator? And then how much does the generator, like you haven’t worked that powers 40 acres and how many buildings costs?

Speaker 2:

So our generator was about $1500 bucks.

Speaker 1:

Yeah. And it can power our RV for how many days?

Speaker 2:

Well, infinitely, as long as we have gas. So as long as you have gasoline to put in it, you know, power it forever. So it would run up to 50 amps off of our trailers, a 30 amp trailer, but it’s designed for up to 50 amps.

Speaker 1:

Okay. And then how many buildings do you have on your campus and how many employees and just

Speaker 2:

We have about 200 employees on that campus. And actually we have a generator for each building and we’ve got about a dozen buildings, but each of those generators are big, big gas generators that run about a hundred thousand dollars a piece. So,

Speaker 1:

I mean, we would probably need to have that on our property. Right. I mean, not right away, that’s expensive, but yeah.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. We we’d have something probably not as big as the one, one of the generators for one of our buildings, because we

Speaker 1:

Run district stuff.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. Some kind of emergency backup. What else? Oh,

Speaker 1:

This just got really expensive really quick.

Speaker 2:

The big question that I always had when I was a kid for the astronauts is where do you pee? You have to handle the stuff that comes out of your body and the stuff that comes out of your, your shower and your sinks. There’s going to be different regulations in different areas. For the most part where we’re looking, you can run your gray water just straight to the, out to the ground, out to a drain. We’re actually looking at draining our gray water systems. So when you take a shower, you wash your dishes in the sink or whatever, run that through a streaming system. And then the effluent water will that’s, what’s going to give you lemon trees, probably shouldn’t snooze through this part. And then your pee and poo needs to be handled differently. So you have to look at whether you’re going to have composting toilets. Are you going to have a septic system? Is your septic system going to be large enough to take care of the people that you serve?

Speaker 1:

God. I know that we’ve talked about this tons of times, but man, you’re really breaking it down. I want to set our friends up for success. And I love sharing information because everyone’s going to do it differently. But at least, you know, if they’re doing the right thing for the right people, let’s set them up in a way that makes them be successful.

Speaker 2:

Which brings me to the last piece and that’s internet. Cause we’ve talked about power water and handling your wastewater internet is going to be another big thing. And a lot of the old school places, they didn’t really take into consideration that the internet piece, they haven’t put in a lot of money into upgrading the internet infrastructure. But for us, when we look at properties we’re going to be next to probably BLM land. We’re going to make sure that we have solar power on our property. We’re going to make sure that we have a water source and water storage. We’re going to take care of our wastewater appropriately. And then we’re going to make sure that we have access to internet somehow that’s a reliable speed. It may not be the fastest internet in the world.

Speaker 1:

It’s going to be the fastest in the world. You can be assured that I’m going to have the best internet I can have.

Speaker 2:

Best you can have, but it may

Speaker 1:

See how I course corrected there. Yeah.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker 1:

If you want good internet and to hang out naked, you can come to our nude camp.

I’ve been in the real estate industry and I’ve bought and sold homes. And I actually, I took a very interesting Airbnb class while I was working for the realtor. Actually, I wouldn’t mind talking about that really quick, but I would say the first best you can do is find a good land broker that isn’t going to lie to you and isn’t going to sell you something that’s not going to work because that’s, I think that’s the most important thing. And then one of the interesting things I found out when I took an Airbnb class, because a lot of you guys, you know, if you’re doing this might be listing your stuff on Airbnb. If it stays around with how the economy is going and if it’s not, we’re going to have Nude BnB soon at some point 

Speaker 2:

Soon ish it’s relevant to relevant terms.

Speaker 1:

Yeah. I mean, we, we had all these plans and then the pandemic came and then, and  the pandemic is staying. I think it’s gonna be around for two more years now. So it’s made us reevaluate when we’re launching things. And but so this Airbnb class was super interesting because it was actually these people in Seattle that are brokers. So you actually list your Airbnb through them and they put your Airbnb, sorry. They put your property on Airbnb. And what they do is they figure out the market fluctuations for the seasons. And so they adjust your pricing for your rental accordingly, which I thought was super interesting. And then a few other points that they brought up, which I thought were great cause I have had rental houses before and just renters always seem to trash my houses, which is why I don’t want to have rent rentals anymore. I just, I’ve had to put too many of my houses back together after renters. What happens when you Airbnb your place is that it gets cleaned after every time someone stayed there, which if you guys have an Airbnb, you understand this already, obviously. And I hope I don’t sound condescending, but I wanted to share this information with people that may not know that because I didn’t think about that.

Speaker 2:

Well, and there’s a social value too, because whether you’re listing your property on Airbnb or if you are a renter on Airbnb, you’re building social value. So you get rated as a good, a good tenant.

Speaker 1:

Yeah. And a lot of people, what happens is because they recognize they’re in someone’s backyard or someone’s home or whatever, they treat it differently. We had a lovely stay again in Eugene, these people had put an Airbnb structure in the back of their house and it was the first Air BnB that I had stayed in where I didn’t just get a key code and walked in. So the woman met us, you know, walked us through the structure because it was also a Covid thing. Like she wanted us to make sure that she had cleaned the shit out of the house and all that stuff. And when you meet the person that is hosting you, you don’t want to fuck up their house. I mean, you don’t want to mess up their house anyhow. But I mean, I feel like that particular feels more personal. And then, you know, we’re in their backyard. So the next morning her husband comes out and then I pet their dog and then, Oh my God, what was happening in the alleyway the next morning?

Speaker 2:

We’re right next door to a farm that was raising bell peppers. And I woke up in the morning and I could hear like the hiss of a barbecue or something. And some just like low level voices. It was just kind of peaceful, but like something’s going on outside? Well, there was a, it was a co-op and these people had picked the, picked the peppers, and then they were putting them in a roasting basket and they were roasting these, these peppers. So I went outside and, Oh man, the smell was amazing. If you’ve never smelled fresh roasted peppers in volume, it was incredible. And then they were steaming them in Brown paper bags.

Speaker 1:

Yeah. But you know, it definitely makes the experience different. It makes people look at their experience with you, different how they leave your space. And you know, with Airbnb, you want to make sure that when you leave, you leave it clean so that they give you a good rating as a renter. So I feel like those are some of the benefits of Airbnb. I know that people have had issues in the past with people partying and messing up their houses. I know that Airbnb has upped their insurance policy to cover more things. But anyway, I don’t mean to be talking about Airbnb so much, but I just thought that was a few interesting anecdotes that I realized that I had learned when I worked for a realtor. Because again, I think the most important thing is just getting a good person that’s knowledgeable helping you buy that land in the first place.

On a scale of one to 10,

Speaker 1:

I know we’ve been researching this for like five years.

Speaker 2:

I feel like a pretty solid nine right now. So

Speaker 1:

That means we’re close you guys, we’re getting closer for next year, 2022

Speaker 2:

Yeah. I think so.

Speaker 1:

Get me out of here. 

Speaker 2:

I think the big thing is cause we’ve looked, we’ve had all kinds of plans to look at different places from the Virgin islands to Southern part of the United States to Texas and Arizona. And I think,

Speaker 1:

Or before the pandemic.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. We’ve checked things out everywhere. I mean we’ve

Speaker 1:

Well, and Jeremy would still, he, you want St. Croix bad. I’m not going to lie.

Speaker 2:

I’d actually love to be in the Virgin islands, but it’s, I think to serve everybody in the United States, it’s, it’s better for us to look in California for right now.

You know, I just remembered earlier, we were going to talk about the size of our space. And I don’t think we actually did it because they keep talking about infrastructure. Yeah. So we live in, we live in a trailer. 

Speaker 1:

I hate how that sounds. But I’d like to say I’m Chrissy Tiegen of the trailer park.

Speaker 2:

It’s about 35 feet long by eight feet wide. And it’s got a couple of slide outs, but I’ve calculated the livable usable living space, which turns out to be about 250 square feet or a little over 23 square meters. So it’s tiny.

Speaker 1:

You have to really like who you live with. If you live in a space like this and you know, I think it would be more optimal if we weren’t in a place that rains so much, because even as much as we like each other and get along, we really do. We were best friends before we got married. I mean, he is my friend before anything. He reminds me like, I grew up in a neighborhood with all boys and he just reminds me of one of my childhood buddies and it rains so much, you’re stuck inside. So you really have to like who you’re stuck inside with. But I mean, I feel like a lot of people get that with, with the pandemic. But you know, if, if we, if this RV was not on 40 acres where we can go roam

Speaker 2:

Well, and I’ve been fortunate in that

Speaker 1:

I know when he’s gone back to work, I’ve been working from home was a nightmare.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. I really like this check, but when I was working from home every single day,

Speaker 1:

Yeah. The space does not allow for that. It just, it really doesn’t – what the space is perfect for is for him to go to work everyday, get out of my face. And I get the whole place to myself and I use this space as an office in the woods. That’s what it’s fantastic for. It is the perfect size for that. And what did we talk about earlier? It’s also the perfect size for like construction.

Speaker 2:

It’s one of those construction trailers. You’d go, you know, when a building’s getting remodeled or if you see on a movie and they’re doing a high rise building, that’s about the size of this trailers. Yeah.

Speaker 1:

Well, if you’re going to build out 40 acres, throw an RV on it and live in it while you’re building something. And I know plenty of people have put an RV in their parents’ driveway while they’re building houses and lived in it with like dogs and stuff. You had also told me though that people aren’t really supposed to live in RVs.

Speaker 2:

Actually. Yeah. So this is why it’s important to do your research first because we did a bunch of research before we came up here, but I didn’t know the things that I didn’t know. And one of those

Speaker 1:

I’m interjecting right now, because you can do as much research online but until you move into that boat community, until you live on that boat, until you live with the nudists, you only have scratched the surface of any of it.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. And you can’t always rely on the rules and regulations within a particular park because those rules and regulations may have been made up before codes changed in local government. So the rules in some of these places allow folks to live in RVs forever and ever. In fact, some places allow you to take the wheels off your RV and put it on concrete blocks or on a foundation or whatever, and build structures around your RV. But we found out after we started living here that it’s not legal to live in an RV for more than six months,

Speaker 1:

Which for those people at home listening? What should we have looked for to find that out? Like, okay, you can’t, you can’t always, depending on the people that you think you can depend on for the information you need to know. Right. So if someone’s going to live at a place like this, or they’re thinking about it, or they’re thinking about opening a place like this – what city or County regulations do you have to look into like specifically?

Speaker 2:

Yeah. So where we live, we live in an unincorporated area of the County. So the only codes that apply would be federal state and County codes. The areas that we’re looking at down in California are also in just County rural areas. So we’ll look at County state and federal guidelines, but sometimes if you’re looking in a city, you also have to look at what the city codes are. So there’s zoning core codes and ordinances and

Speaker 1:

Blah, blah, blah. And on the last thing I’d like to talk about. Cause I think this is interesting.

Speaker 2:

Can I, can I interject one more thing? So what’s really helpful is if you go to the County assessor’s map, cause usually even if you’re in a city, the local County will be the one that collects the taxes for that city. And if you look at the County assessor’s map, most counties are online now, then you can actually see what all the laws and regulations are within that area and how they’re zoned. And you can go look up what the guidelines are around that particular code. So I know it’s the boring stuff, but it’s the important.

Speaker 1:

Well, now I don’t remember what else I was going to say because it wasn’t that important. So maybe we should end on that note. If you guys have any questions though or anything, I, we would love to share our knowledge. You can drop a comment in the note section on our show notes page, you can tweet at me, you can DM me on Instagram. I always respond because I’m not working. You guys are my main business these days. But yeah, we’d love to share our knowledge and help anybody that is trying to do this. And Hey, maybe you want to be part of our franchise someday. We’ll just throw that out there. That’s what I’m doing. He’s going to find the land. I’m going to do the franchise. 

Speaker 2:

So if there’s more information that you want or if you miss something that we were saying in our podcast and you don’t want to go back and rewatch it, you can go to the show notes. You can read our blog and you can subscribe to this podcast by heading over to www.naturistpodcast.com. And we’ll see you next week. Thanks for joining us.